The Future of Feed Me

[Anddy]

4)League system

So far, the league system has worked properly, but a new exception may be made for 2-3 seasons.I think that the number of teams that will come out of div2 should be certain, and when more than div1 teams are closed, the team that will rise to div1 should not be from div2.Because this negatively affects the league quality.For example, 3 teams will be rise from div2 and the remaining teams will be added directly to div1 from the application list.These teams, on the other hand, can be selected among the teams applying to the league, champion captains (Isco, ES Pierre, wroz) and stable and reliable captains (Meyzi,Enzo, Suarez N7, Progamer) will can have priority for div1.

Players like Flaviu, Punisher, and Smithyo apply every season but they are not joined. I am not sure whether the team they formed will be permanent.A side league can be opened for such captains who have previously closed their teams and whom you find unreliable.Captains who have previously closed teams and captains who have not gained your trust can compete in that league for 1 season and after be added to the FM league .At the very least, these people should be given this chance. If they gain your trust they should be added to the FM league. Otherwise, these people will not be admitted to this league no matter what they do, which is a bit of a heartbreak for them.

Great post from ROCKYBALBOA.

For 4th point, I think FeedMe has always had a kind of "strange" way to add new teams to league.
I mean, I used to be part of an admin team doing these decisions aswell, I can admit something should have been changed already ages ago.

The problem is that in FeedMe all new teams are always starting from Division 2. I can understand the logic behind this (with relegation/promotion system) but on the other hand, could some new teams start straight from Division 1 ?

Let me give an example. Two teams from Division 1 are about to disband or are at least losing some of their best players. These players are planning to creatie a new team for the next season in FeedMe. Admin team is of course accepting them (no reason not to do it) but they are also putting them to Division 2 like all other new teams even though that team iscould easily be Division 1 level.
What happens next? That team is winning almost every game and with a big goal difference in Division 2. What's the point of this?
Would it be better to add them straight to Division 1 to bring more competitiveness to the league and at the same time making Division 2 more even.

I understand that some Division 2 are losing interest to playing. It's not fun to play in Division 2 against the teams that should be playing in higher division. Due to this and also the map itself, they are slowly losing the fun part of playing and are eventually going through the disband.

Some captains have applied for several seasons but never got accepted. Maybe it's time to give them a chance and thus FeedMe could get more activity which is clearly needed.

Reminds me of hobA in HBC (former french community) in 2011

In BFF, since the newest seasons, admin team picks which teams goes to which division and some players are not allowed to compete in div2.
Pre season can also help with putting unexpected teams in div 1.

I am aware that in feed me, the level gap is much thiner and it's hard to judge the level of a team but some subset of bff system could make fm a bit better

[Lee]

Very nice suggestions but one thing is missing, stop with the elitism/toxicity!

But really, this game won't attract any new players, so it's time to cater towards the current crop of haxballers. Haxball has done extraordinary well to retain this amount of activity for so long, so it's time to accept it won't gain any new players and it could have been said so many years ago.

I think tinker with the maps a bit. I remember when I played there was always 4def arguments, just a simple line added to the map could have solved that completely, but it never happened. There was a shout earlier in this thread for there to be bigger goals and i can get aboard that, becaause gameplay has gotten too stale. Things need to be radically change to reinvoke interest in this, this league has been too far in it's comfort zone that it's time to break out of it.

[Lyreco]

fm should change map and bring dogan back, thats all

[spookymane]

my thoughts:
*basro is mf who DOES NOT DESERVES US. cant believe dis mf increased the ex limit to 1000.
*league format is good wtf yall problem elo sucks
*there is no way to play in fm or any haxball league if you dont have a retard-kid friend. fm-discord revolution & fm-public hosts needed. maybe yall can create a g-league type development league for new playas.
*the culture needs to change in haxball (imagine you're new at this game & some retard ex abuser bullying you in public). we gotta create new player-friendly community. yall forgot enjoy da game in these days. yall win a league and act like you're silas beavers (dont get me wrong, dis team was full of good characters tho, yall act like some diva) i wish we have more positive & mature communication here.

*extrapolationless haxball clone/league/client is a must, hire punisher, he said he can do it earlier*. issa cheat its like wallhack yall know dat. i'm sure there are guys w hacks who eliminate disadvantage of high ex like baby kicks. i wanna try extrapolationless hax so bad. (*: viewtopic.php?f=188&t=11887)

*map change is a big issue but it should definitely be considered for example im not active but if i join i play 4v4 in huge (a polish room, maybe yall know its very active) nowadays.

*kick rate limit sucks i think, if you're still using macro in 2k23 f your life bro you're f loser. i can smoke all macro users no need dat limit. goodbye

[Fernando Torres]

I know it can sound like too much of a change but try Fustal maybe? I started playing Haxball again after like 2 years and I was surprised to see that there are no longer classic Big rooms, not even one. It's mainly fustal now. So I've been playing this for a while and it's actually fun. I doubt most players here will hate it, some might even like it more. From what I've seen lately there are a lot of fustal players so many new players will probably join. And by the way, I already saw quite a few smart and super technical players on this map which is probably harder than Big because the ball is smaller and faster, just in case you think there wouldn't be a fun challenging competition.
If the idea sounds possible to you maybe you should do a vote and ask players whether they'd like to try it or not.

[Hannes]

If the wildcard match is played with a different team the following week, it must be played mandatory. If the wild card is dealt 2 weeks in a row. 3 matches must be played in the 3rd week. We also see that some players have a hard time waiting. In this case, it should be mandatory to specify the match times on the forum in advance.
If both teams agree, +1 more day may be given.

league format sucks, every second match (if you are lucky) is wildcarded and people choke the hell out of the captains to decide when to play them

1. Limit to play wildcard matches 1 week after.
2. The wildcard games have to be played between 20 and 22 cet time.

Wildcards are an issue, reducing the time to 7 days is of course possible we can do that, but does it solve a problem?
I've been telling people to write any wildcard enquiries and agreements in the according threads, its barely happening.
Im open to put this into some stricter rule, how could it look like to get this better organized?
Also we will try to get the wc reminders back, as whitee was doing...

Maybe fewer wildcards in general? Bigger Squads for having enough people to play?

3. Your own hosts, to study the players and to avoid multi-accounts

Maybe we can try to provide some more FM-Hosts

4. If is possible, scripting a 3def code that dont allow to do 4defs

Maybe a custom map with a drawn line is enough?

]6. Change the kickrate limit, that with 6 12 4 doesnt work for macro players.

/kick_ratelimit 2 60 3

Open to adjust that, what could work better?

Social Media, Commercial and this stuff. Creating tiktoks and some other posts. Like Highlights of a Match, interviews or livestreams of the Match of the Day. Mainly i think about making feedme more aware for peoples. Maybe this leads to more New players. Maybe also accept more teams and create a third League. More quantity in players And Fill League. Increase the admin/Support Staff to Control the masses of New players . At the same time, enforce the rules more. Perhaps set up a small anti-cheat team to discuss whether someone has hacked in a game.

Can you be our tiktok ambassador please?
And sure it would be nice to have highlights, interviews and livestreams back.

Maybe a 3on3 League would be a good idea. See Nordhax, haxleague, PCH... there are a lot of players not knowing feedme or being Registered. I dont think they even know teamspeak

We can bring back the 3v3 side-league if there is enough interest.
Its also possible on another map like futsal.

The current map is not good for this league. In the top level games match is usually ending 0-0 0-1 1-1 bcs the only way u can score is random spam goal/counter attack.
That's why in my opinion the goals should be bigger not like in big easy but definitely bigger than the current ones. The games are gonna be more interesting to watch, more goals etc.

In this last season in Division1 there were three 0-0, five 1-1 and five 1-0 results(which makes it 15 of 90 matches), i wouldnt call that "usually".
But still we can try out other maps, like big easy or your idea with something in-between. Maybe the cup could be played on another map.

4v4 BIG EASY

Cup map maybe?

the game is dying. it was going to happen sooner or later anyways

Its already dead for 13 years. We're just zombies.

A public room could work for this, as there are still a lot of players in pub. In my opinion opening a public room and managing it actively could help to get more activity in FM again, with new, fresh and hopefully active players. Also the idea of ELO sounds very interesting to me. Even if FM admin team don't want to set up an ELO on their own, some cooperation could work I think. It should be tested by the FM admins.

A public FM room can be done, if you have specific ideas how to specifically implement it, please elaborate; constant room-admins? a bot?

A side league can be opened for such captains who have previously closed their teams and whom you find unreliable.Captains who have previously closed teams and captains who have not gained your trust can compete in that league for 1 season and after be added to the FM league .At the very least, these people should be given this chance. If they gain your trust they should be added to the FM league.

Im not sure if i understand this fully, how exactly would such side league work?

5)Head to head average

The average system should definitely be changed and it should be head to head average.Head to head average is both a fairer system and a closed system to speculation.

this can be done

The problem is that in FeedMe all new teams are always starting from Division 2. I can understand the logic behind this (with relegation/promotion system) but on the other hand, could some new teams start straight from Division 1 ?

Is that really the problem?
Implementing teams straight to Div1 undermines the whole idea of a league structure, all teams should have the equal chance to promote themself to Div1.
Just deciding over who goes Div1 is like nepotism.

Another idea could be to remove Div2 completely, putting all teams into one single Division, depending on how many teams participating.

For 4th point, I think FeedMe has always had a kind of "strange" way to add new teams to league.
I mean, I used to be part of an admin team doing these decisions aswell, I can admit something should have been changed already ages ago.

I can understand it being "strange". But what could be a better way without just let everyone do what they want?




Also wanna try to get more funcups again, if you wanna try hosting some, feel free to contact Meyzi or me on ts.

And concerning discord. While teamspeak will stay the main platform, we might can get the discord managed again in some way to maybe get some synergy effects.

[Haku]

I've been running the team for two seasons here, and I've been playing the game for a long time. I'll also allow myself to say something.

Let me start with the fact that, as I remember, in the past team recruitment consisted mainly of accepting well-known and proven teams where players were not anonymous, which meant that new characters had no chance of getting into the league games, which made FeedMe a closed community only for "their own", and since the prose of life and time gets everyone, the group began to shrink, the effects of which we have today. There was an opinion among many players that there was no point in even trying to apply here. Relying on the same people over and over again was bound to end up like this sooner or later.

Second thing is the specific and not very accessible name of the site. Many players from the modern generation have no idea about the existence of FeedMe because it's hard to find this league without being more knowledgeable, and apart from the community tab on the Haxball website, there is no other form of advertising for those less familiar players, and the entire address of the site is simply difficult and inaccessible to most, so how do you let the new ones know about you?

I think that the above factors, although retail, are very rational and certainly have an impact on how hermetic this community has become.

Now I'm going to discuss some of the above suggestions and confront them with the current situation here.

Considering the previous season, firstly, you should ensure more regularity, because the update of results and match statistics was slightly delayed, which indicates a small moderator squad. In addition, solving disputes should be more accurate and faster because there has been a lot of chaos here recently. These issues definitely need to be improved.

As a traditional Haxball player who grew up on standard maps, I don't like the idea of changing it to any non-standard one. What's more, it would be an abstraction and desecration of the history and the entire heritage of this community, and this is the last big forum to be treated with respect and a note of seriousness, cause the rest of what's left are some random Discords.

The only option to change the map seems to be a perspective with Big Easy or a custom 3-def map that would automatically draw a line, which would make it easier for players who are less familiar with the rules. Any other change may involve an imminent fall and make this place a small game for Sunday enthusiasts of custom maps.

The next thing is to stop succumbing to toxic pressure from players who devalue this environment and to stand up to them, even at the cost of shrinking the league. People who transfer their mental problems to other teams and players are also to blame for the fact that there are fewer and fewer others because this game is just only fun, and if someone takes away the taste of it, why bother? A tough and clear stance for everyone, if someone can't adapt, is a trip, not fear of a possible loss of the team.

I think that the most interesting of all the proposals that have been made is to add 3vs3 league and try to create a separate registration for any teams, not, as was the case in the past, assigning the same ones that are in 4vs4 competitions. This style was very popular in its time, and currently there is no normal community in this mode, so I think you should give it a try coz FeedMe is the last bastion of classic HaxBall, and it's doubtful that anything will come after that.

You also need to be aware that everything in life has a cycle, and so does Haxball. This project is 13 years old, and nothing lasts forever. The current competition and affordability of multiplayer games make this game just a curiosity for many people, not something they can really waste their time on. I also think that it is a pity for you to engage in some additional forms like ELO or the like, because these types of modes get exhausted quickly, and mixing players with different levels of play and personalities causes a toxic atmosphere and a lot of inconvenience, which is currently totally unattractive.

What's most important? Improvement of regularity in the form of updating all content on the site, such as tables and player statistics, adding a 3v3 mode, and trying to encourage external players to participate in it. As a last resort, changing the form of the game to Big Easy or an automated map designating the zone for the striker.

I consider the other ideas to be very misguided and incredibly risky.

That's all from me. Good luck!

[Browning]

In my opinion it's useless to change map, the real problem are toxic player that for win a game block ball in corner everytime. I propose to count loss of time during the game as 3 mans, so one more time exceed the maximum limit of the game. violations they will get a deflose.

[Jesé]

A public room could work for this, as there are still a lot of players in pub. In my opinion opening a public room and managing it actively could help to get more activity in FM again, with new, fresh and hopefully active players. Also the idea of ELO sounds very interesting to me. Even if FM admin team don't want to set up an ELO on their own, some cooperation could work I think. It should be tested by the FM admins.

A public FM room can be done, if you have specific ideas how to specifically implement it, please elaborate; constant room-admins? a bot?

It should be a mix of both. A bot is essential for the attractiveness of a room, because it keeps the room alive in my view. But room-admins would be nice. Obviously FM admins should be admin in this room, but the majority could be people from the community, perhaps (some) captains would be an idea? But keep it as a small group.

I'd say try it out and look closely at the activity in the room, won't it be worth it after a while? Then it was a good try and FM should look further to recruit new players. It might be an idea to experiment with the new map (if it comes). It is also good to think about the format. Does it have to be 4v4? Given the past and the limited attention to a 4v4 room, I doubt about it... Or should the threshold be lowered and 3v3 should be played? I leave this to you...

Also, It is good to advertise in the room

[Total]

The map is too small for this sad meta.

TeamSpeak 3 is simply outdated, no1 uses it to find new communities. Closed community = less interest. The word is way easier to spread around in discord. It has way more features to drive people's interest together. "We wont have own channel privacy bla bla bla" More than half of the teams surely already have an existing discord server on their own, which is why you see less people active on teamspeak right now.

[Substancia]

Migrate from TS to Discord, I think people like Haku could help do that

[lsco]

I can relate a lot to what has already been said.

1. It's been a closed community forever, people are growing up nowadays on Discord and Teamspeak is irrelevant, The first thing should be moving to Discord.
2. "Tickets" or "Protests" should've been handled better, I know it's a difficult job to take all of it, especially for so many years but the inconsistency and the late reply for these kinds of situations in the past didn't do well to the league in my opinion, maybe more moderators is the solution.
3. Changing the league system might be something to think about, It feels like every season ends the same. My best suggestion is instead of Div 1 & 2, to make 2 Divisions and then playoff rounds with the top 4 of each division.
4. Tiktok is always good for raising awareness...
5. A "try-out" side league to give more chances to new players.
6. Live streams, interviews, new league website + rebranding.

[Zoro1]

Have an idea

Let's try random pick mode.

Players will apply individually.

There will be a pool of players, let's say we have 100 applications in total.

Will be ideal to have 10 teams. 10 players in each team.

Captains won't be picked randomly, they have to be TOP players. But being only good is not enough, also need to have responsibility to handle a team for a season.

Captains have to be the best players, so we will maintain the balance of power between each team.

Also this way, new players will get a chance to play with top players, which will be definitely a good chance for them to improve their gameplay skills. Will be a good experience.

After captains are picked, then we will give each team random players, one by one.

We won't let captains pick players from the pool on their own to prevent picking their friends. Our aim here is to bring all community members together, meeting each other. Trying something different than usual.

For AGES we are seeing same teams, same group of players together in community

Such as

-Romanians, playing together. aMp and his romanian friends
-Italians stick to each other for eternity
-Turkish groups, same
-Polish groups

and many more.

My point is just to try something different. Will be more exciting I guess. Also will be hard to create a new chemistry with new teammates. This, will be the actual challenge.

If we can get a majority of players wanting to play this tournament, we can think of tournament rules more in detail and put our ideas into a more solid basis.

Just an idea

[1punisher]

I am just wondering @Hannes

If all FM players together create accounts on github and ask basro to create simple app with old flash haxball (some app that can run flash player) and we can play flash there for league and cups idk I think this will be fun. But we have to spam his issues page with different threads until he rly notice ppl want it. And if u can organize it maybe we can get what we want. Bcz he cant fix extrapolation and other shit maybe in flash there is no way to have them so lets play all no exp good haxb

and since it will not change anything in original haxball all he need to do is just open flash web connection servers and simple app to run swf file its really ez bro we should try it rly.

[Smithyo Jr]

[dooms2]

bring back deja, arriba and ACDP in a big mini cup to finally decide the best british team of all time

[Lee]

bring back deja, arriba and ACDP in a big mini cup to finally decide the best british team of all time

You're forgetting ajhax pal

[Gary]

Whilst I don't use Discord myself, I do think Feed Me needs to modernise itself and at least consider the idea of Discord becoming its main platform for players & teams to communicate. Also, I've been thinking that the league format could change to become more flexible and allow teams to play whenever they are available, rather than on specific dates & times - as we see with wildcards, some are tactical decisions, but the majority are used because players aren't available.

The above thought then came with the idea of changing the league system entirely to one that is ELO based. For example, instead of 2 divisions with 10 teams, why not 4 divisions with 5 teams, with each team first having to play x amount of pre-season games to determine their ELO before being assigned a group. This way, I think the best & worst teams will find games more enjoyable if they are playing other teams at their level, with lower chances of them disbanding. Plus teams are free to join as & when during the season?

Ignoring my flexible comment, I guess there'd still need to be official game days, so the system doesn't become too chaotic. Promotion/Relegation could take place on these dates, say every Sunday the 5th placed team in Div1 will play the 1st placed team in Div2 and so on. Whoever is first in Div1 after maybe 2 months will be the champions for that season, with the cup taking place at the end of the season in a funcup style format, maybe.

Of course there could be several leagues, maybe 3v3 Big, 4v4 Big and 4v4 Futsal etc, to attract more players.
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Just throwing the idea out there with the acceptance that it's probably rubbish, but I'm sure the bright minds within the community can improve it.

[Smithyo Jr]

a lot of talk but no actions yet......

[Smithyo Jr]